[Jewelry making - Article 01015] - Re: [Orchid] 3Design Jewel

[Neil George]

========[ Invite a Friend - http://www.ganoksin.com/invite.htm  ]========


>         Mr. George, I do not like your answers to Karen Goeller. 


    Mr. Denayer, You are certainly entitled to your opinion. 

>          In my opinion price means little at the end of the day when
>     it comes to calculating productivity which equals profits. Sure, but
>     at the end of which day? Let's take the example you provide: an
>     individual designs 8 hours a day, 5 day a week, so s/he saves 20 %
>     of the time, which is to say one day, and, hurray, given your
>     calculation, s/he makes an additional $ 12,000 a year. Which year?
>     First, there is practically no individual which can do this unless
>     a very rich one: s/he simply does not have the time, remember s/he
>     is a jeweler with a business, as most of us are. And second, you
>     don't reckon with a learning curve at all. It will take some time
>     - for Rhino it is typically between one of two years - before one
>     can use the program with confidence and with sufficient skill to
>     produce the models you have in mind. And since this tool - as all
>     tools - changes the way you work and think (after all, you are not
>     going to render in Rhino what you can do with your hands already),
>     something else is involved here, namely acquiring a new style,
>     thinking about aesthetics in a new way, exploring the
>     possibilities, changing the way you look at things. It will take
>     quite a while. One day you will make profits. The truth is that no
>     one knows which day this will be. 

    I fully stand by my statements, because of a number of reasons in
    your reply. I agree that your position is quite accurate as far as
    the Rhino scenario is concerned and the anticipated learning curve.
    However, with the new tools, the learning curve is dramatically
    reduced because the solution was developed from the ground up by a
    huge amount of input provided by jewellers. Lists where made on how
    task should be tackled and handled. The logic behind the whole
    solution was a major consideration in its user friendly interface.
    The logical manner in the way it operates, far supercedes anything
    else on the market today geared at Jewellery. Therefore unless you
    have actually run 3Design, I fail to see where you are even qualified
    to make the assumptions you make. You are thinking old school, and
    running with outdated information. Do you even know what a Hybrid
    modeler is and the power it represents?. Did you even look at the
    videos I offered?. The whole point that I was making, was that by
    reducing the amount of time handling a task utilizing CAD, it gives
    you more time to run your business. I really do not care if you buy
    this solution from me, or even at all. My intentions were to offer
    information, and to offer *freely* my experience so you may benefit.
    Many here know what I bring to the table as expertise and I can back
    up everything I say with actions, therefore if you are not interested
    in what I have to say or offer, just delete it. 


>         This is just something that you people say. Your third point
>     is misinformed by this logic too: if a company, you say, does not
>     accumulate enough money to progress further on in two years, then
>     there is something wrong with that business. You completely argue
>     away the points I make here. 

    When you say *you people*, I will assume that you think I am just a
    software solution provider. I actually own a manufacturing business
    that utilizes high tech solutions, and further, I own a Company that
    manufactures Aerospace Components, therefore I hope that sets the
    record straight on that note. I fully comprehend the requirements
    necessary to get involved in the high tech arena, and I fully
    appreciate the commitment it takes to make it a success, so please do
    not lecture me on whether I know anything about running a business or
    not. I stand by the fact, that if no progress has been made in that
    time frame, then, yes, there is something wrong. You state typically
    1-2 years to get proficient in Rhino. Fine, so it takes 1-2 years to
    learn, should you not have learnt something along the way to at least
    make it profitable? When I started, I geared the jobs to my level of
    current expertise at the time, therefore remaining profitable and
    therefore increasing my salability. Your thinking is to wait 1-2
    years and then think what the hell it is you are ready for. Give me a
    break. I offered you free advice. Whether you take it or not, I
    really do not care. 

>            In reality justification should be governed by
>     productivity. Your investment in everyday tools in the kitchen like
>     food processors attest to the fact that we do indeed look for time
>     saving solutions. Yes home cooking like mama used to make, is all
>     very nice and gives us all a warm feeling, but who has the time
>     today to prep all of the required ingredients with just a knife.
>     This is not so and things tend to be more complex than the
>     ideologues of productivity say they are. Basically, one day in the
>     West, people used to work so that they could enjoy the good life -
>     and eating well is certainly part of that enjoyment, but we have
>     all forgotten about that and the scandal is that all sort of
>     ideological institutions in our society call this progress (and
>     freedom, etc.). There is already liquid food on the market, which
>     only takes a couple of seconds to digest, so I'm sure we can
>     increase productivity even more if we would all drink it and skip
>     dinners altogether. This decision makes perfect sense if decisions
>     should be governed by productivity. 

    The information I provided was intended for you not to have to rely
    on a liquid lunch. The whole intention was for you to receive
    information that may, or may not benefit you, and actually allow you
    to eat a solid meal. Productivity in my opinion equates to more time
    off not less. If you are more productive in less time by utilizing
    smart solutions then for me that's the bottom line. 

>             It would be selfish and self serving of the student to
>     become my or anyone else's competitor at a tenth of what I invested
>     to get the same thing. I am a firm believer in "if you wanna play,
>     you gotta pay". The sweat and tears that myself and many others put
>     into building a business, only to have someone enter the same
>     arena without the grief and financial commitment that we went
>     through. That in my opinion is not right. I believe that if an
>     individual or a business is investing in any form or manner in
>     software and hardware, then they should be protected, and not
>     undermined in any shape or form. In other words, competition has to
>     be complete, lest the results which markets create will be
>     distorted and unfair. Proponents of this logic typically often use
>     the picture of a bicycle race: we all start together and the one
>     who comes in first is the winner because he is the strongest, the
>     most capable one. However, in society, such races do not exist
>     naturally, which is the reason why we *organize* them. Situations
>     at the beginning are never equal, indeed, there is no beginning as
>     society is made up of several generations and many, many other
>     relevant differences. There is no altruism involved here.
>     Educational prices increase the number of people using the
>     product, which, as a result of this, may lower prices of the
>     product in general. Educational prices bring the product in contact
>     with the developers and the users of tomorrow, i.e. the people who
>     are likely going to innovate the product and we're not against
>     progress, are we? Other arguments can be made for educational
>     prices on the basis of sound economic reasoning. Educational prices
>     distort the market in no other way than the introduction of the
>     product distorted the market to begin with. There is no reason why
>     this could not be accepted as a mere fact of life, to be reckoned
>     with when purchasing a software program. 

    AutoCad and MasterCam did the exact same thing you are talking
    about. Yes at that time it was probably a smart decision according to
    the so called think tankers, and I would agree that it does sound
    quite logical to think so. It did succeed initially in getting
    product recognition, however today, AutoCad and MasterCam are old
    technologies. What happened?, well they continued to build on that
    old technology with platforms that required major overhauling to
    bring it to the next level. Point is, there was not enough money
    coming in to warrant the development required to ensure its dominant
    position in the market place today.  Hence old hats. All they did was
    open the door to their new competitors who had the latest
    technological scripts and line codes running their software. Users
    now knew about the technology, and essentially the marketing and the
    education of customers was a much easier task for the new kids on the
    block. They still sell, but nowhere near the sales they had in the
    old days. Trained students did not mean more sales, because most did
    NOT buy once they left school/college, their potential employers
    already had a seat. Therefore the increase in revenue from that
    situation was peanuts, and in actuality contributed to their eventual
    downfall from the premium software list. The thought that readily
    trained individuals coming out of educational facilities would put an
    employer in a position of sticking with old technology was grossly
    underestimated. 

    Therefore, your point of reduced costs to the students, could very
    well mean less money coming into that business to further develop the
    product. Therefore it affects everyone in a negative fashion. I will
    be the one eventually paying  for your freebie, because ultimately, I
    will have to fork out top dollars again for the newest solution when
    I shouldn't have to. Instead of an upgrade, I have to move elsewhere.
    Where does that leave the student?. Trained and experienced in
    technology that has no future. Many of the AutoCad and MasterCam
    users are having to retrain, because now the Companies are running
    Catia, ProE, Solidworks, Solidedge, Think3, Top Solid, PowerShape.
    Yes the fact that they have an existing background in CAD may help
    get them in the door, but not if they are being interviewed along
    with another potential employee that is up to date on the current
    technology. On the Machining side, ProManufacturing, Catia,
    PowerMill,  WorkNC, SolidCam, and even now this will change in the
    next 12 months. StepNC is the next technology.  However in saying
    that, the companies of today, are better positioned in their lines of
    code and the use of Parametrics and kernell to move and improve along
    with the new technologies than AutoCad or MasterCam where. 

    I am by no means suggesting that Rhino is no longer a solution, on
    the contrary, but times have changed for it also. It has its place,
    and it will continue to sell in its own niche markets, and that's all
    I have to say about that. 

Take it for what it's worth.

Best regards.
Neil George
954-572-5829




____________________________________________________________________
T h e   O r c h i d   L i s t
Open Electronic Forum for Jewelry Manufacturing Methods and Procedures
____________________________________________________________________
Orchid FAQ:
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/orchid/faq.htm
Orchid Archives:
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/orchid/archive
Orchid Galleries:
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/orchid/gallery.htm
Invite a Friend:
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/invite.htm
____________________________________________________________________
Tips From The Jeweler's Bench - Article Archive
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/borisat/tip_sear.htm
The Jeweler's Selected Bibliography List
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/jewelry-books
Buy Orchid Jewelry:
~ http://www.ganoksin.com/shop
____________________________________________________________________
-Unsubscribe:
-Email: orchid-request AT ganoksin.com Body=unsubscribe subject=blank
____________________________________________________________________